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The Science Barge


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Old 09-17-2010, 08:11 AM
Hydropoics Blog Hydropoics Blog is offline
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Default The Science Barge

With all the environmental issues facing the planet these days, it’s not often you hear about real viable solutions to any of the problems that can be fully taken advantage of right now. But the Science Barge project (started in 2006) is one of those viable solutions. By taking common technology, and combining them together, [...]

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Old 09-18-2010, 05:59 PM
watercatwn6535nd watercatwn6535nd is offline
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yes and know its still a giant carbon foot print as its operated by veggie oil. now if they add a paddle wheel and produce off set lighting then will be getting closer. love the idea but i think it needs to be taken to the roof tops and there you will find wind and led lighting you'll have a real farm.

i do like some of the vidoes my favorite is the kid that has never seen a tomotoe growing? Scared me to death when i heard that so now i ask every kid i meet that question.
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Old 09-18-2010, 09:21 PM
GpsFrontier GpsFrontier is offline
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The generator is only a backup, they get 92% of there electricity from the solar and wind. The vegetable oil is recycled, otherwise it would probably wind up in a land fill, also the generator doesn't put out carbon emissions. The paddle wheel idea is a good one, although the water would need to be moving like in a river or stream, but would be quite useful in some locations (even if the flowing water is in a different location). The water under the boat is quite still in the bay where it's docked at the moment. And Yes the idea is to teach people about the technology's and have gardens on roof-tops (and other places), the barge idea was intended to allow the whole prototype to be moved from city to city, in order to educate people all over with it.
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Old 09-19-2010, 08:22 AM
watercatwn6535nd watercatwn6535nd is offline
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I didnt realize it was to travel around. How does veggy oil buring in a generator not put out carbon? I like the idea a lot but its so small and doesnt have a food impact on its town its in people just think of it as a fad. I see the videos and the people visting it look like they are vivsting a futuristic ship to take them to mars. I can just imagine all pot growers are getting more from the tour than anyone else. If it ever gets to my area i should want to be a volunteer.
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Old 09-19-2010, 09:32 AM
GpsFrontier GpsFrontier is offline
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Quote:
How does veggy oil buring in a generator not put out carbon?
To be honest, I am not a chemist, and can't tell you exactly. Though I have read from two places that leads to that effect. One is from here:

http://nysunworks.org/wp-content/upl...escription.pdf
"CB-1750 51 kW vegetable oil furnace (Cleanburn) (seasonal use)"

Also I do know (Not saying this is the case but) you can take any engine/motor and make it clean burning with the right filters in the exhaust system.

Quote:
I like the idea a lot but its so small and doesnt have a food impact on its town its in people just think of it as a fad.
I think you are still missing the point. the barge was never meant to solve the problem and feed the city with it's produce. It is however a prototype on how that can be done. As you mentioned having these on every rooftop in a major city will do a lot of good (not one barge). The barge is meant to teach how it can be done, not to feed the world. It has been estimated that all the rooftops in NY is enough space to feed all the residence of New York state. That's the point.

You cant expect someone to spend the money to build a system to feed millions, without it being a proven system in the first place. The Science barge has been on-going sense 2006, that has given them time to accumulate lots of data. If your waiting for someone o build a farming operation that will feed the city of New York, well that's what everyone's waiting for. That's Why it hasn't been done, they all want to leave it up to someone else. That's the point of the Science Barge, to teach a better way to the young people (that are not stuck on the old ways).

Do you remember 20 years ago, computers were just starting out, bulky and slow (even though it didn't seem like it at the time). It was because of the students (and there knowledge) we have progressed to this point (not a that's all we can do attitude). All technology, and progress, is dew to people with the passion to better things. Young or old. Although the young tend to not remember the past, allowing them to focus on the future.
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Old 09-19-2010, 01:36 PM
watercatwn6535nd watercatwn6535nd is offline
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I dont think I'm missing the point the experiment is worthy. But if its not impacting a community its not going to catch on. Also its layed out to complicated looking the average person does not run a single pump in there day to day lives let alone solar panels generators and a barge. I realize thats not what there selling to the public but it looks like a college science project. which it is and since most visitor have not been through college i think the intimidation factor is immense.

I know with my simple bucket system I find that most people looking at my system for the 20th time are still lost and that's after i have given the grand tour and how it works stuff several times.

Not there fault its wildly under funded. Its a difficult concept to grasp at best. most persons do not under stand pressure or vacuum and have never heard of water friction or water balance in tanks.

I remember years ago setting up my first DWC (DEEP WATER CULTURE) system and i think it was 9 buckets. It took me weeks to figure out that you can not hook each tank in series and expect them all to be at the same height for H2o inside with out a balance tube. I had buckets stacked up a inch or so higher at each bucket and in the end had a stair case with a pump at the bottom. Any how even with good books there is so much trial and error.

Another factor in showing hydro off is that the people you show it to that think they know everything and comprehend a lot less than they think leave and then give out poor or the wrong info to others seeking the info. Drives me crazy to be some where and some knuckle head family member is tell a good dirt Gardner about my system and how it works and is going against nature in there thesis. I have yet to find the person that wants to go through it all again so they have the correct info and even less interested in trying it.

So we need a better tech delivery system that is super low tech. I have thought about this and i may be building it right now. A single bucket or barrel (55 gal for me) with a simple fish tank air pump to add oxygen and stir the nutrient. I think the plant is a big factor in how it is perceived as a viable simple project. I think you have to allow them to see foliage growing as well as how natural the roots are growing. I say roots because most gardeners truly have no idea what roots truly look like. they see them but they see them with dirt they dig plants up and dont get the full view of the entire plant like in hydro.

So when they see hydro they think mad scientist and it doesn't help that we talk about larger yields increased size of fruit. Or even worse grwoing in doors with out sun light. We use to burn witch's at the stake for less of a offense.

Any how my barrel design is for my own green house but i am installing a door in the side and growing potato's in it with hrdo of course. this way the kids can go out and open the door harvest the potato with scissors and the plant wont even know.

for those of you that dont trim roots i have been trimming my roots like a hair cut for many years now and never have seen a issue from it. i like to keep them 3 inch's off the bottom of my buckets so that they dont plug my drain lines.

With potato's grown this way people would be able to see the root is still normal the plant is still normall for foilage. This i believe would help the average dirt farmer see the whole plant in action and take away the anxeity of the alien technology recovered from area 51.

Also it will be a must to make tea nutrient from the basic two bucket, five gallon bucket method. two buckets put together with the top bucket having small drain holes then it filled with the gardeners compost and then water poured in it to wash the nutes out and leave the matter behind. With out this you will never bring over the first group of growers to the new technology and they will be the easiest because they are already the back yard gardener. Every one wants to be organic from the earth and these people wont buy processed nutes from big corporations. Miracle grow,and lawn care stuff from the chevron company doesn't count they all were sold to them as the best stuff on earth. imagine if shell oil wanted to sell going green in hydro that's what we need. big money big ad company's.

Once you show them a simple set up like this and they use it they can start experimenting like all of have done on there systems and in just a few years it would be common to have raised gardens of hydro. how many gardeners would like to never till soil again!

The barge is awesome but it is done by teachers and it should be ran by a ad agency "selling it is what we need".

GPS are you growing anything under lights this fall winter besides starts for spring?
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Old 09-20-2010, 04:53 AM
GpsFrontier GpsFrontier is offline
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OK,
I am not that pessimistic though. I also know that it takes time to make changes in peoples thinking (as you eluded to). But the point of the barge is to teach the new generation a new way, not try to teach old dogs new tricks (even though it's open to the public). The main goal is to teach the collage students through example. Of coarse what collage student has the money you need to do a start-up like that (not many). But they have a open mind and are not set in the old ways, and can influence people etc., and they are the future growers (that's the goal). The the goal is to teach others how, not to raise the funds so they can.

I guess it's in how you look at things. I don't see it as some futuristic science experiment. I suppose some could, although I just can't/don't (and I'm 42 years old). But it's up to the persons personality I guess. Every day after school I went dumpster diving, next to our condos was an apartment building that had 15-20 dumpsters. I found all kinds of stuff including over 100 telephones one time when they did some remodeling. I took everything I found interesting home and took it apart to see how it worked (what's to loose, I can throw it away myself if needed). My point is, that I'm a curious person by nature, and it's just hard for me to think otherwise, and I cant see myself being alone in that.

I know from personal experience that telling others about hydroponics is not the easiest thing to do. Fact is, they always make a joke about growing pot, as if that was the only thing you can grow with hydroponics. But over time I have been able to convince most of them there many benefits to growing hydroponically (and not just pot, even old timers), even convinced a few to try it themselves (and people who only knew growing in dirt). One barge wont change the world, but it does show that it can be changed if people really want it to. I do agree that if there are some company's that want to sell the idea/concept of better farming it would be a great idea. I personally plan to do just that. I plan to build a hydro farm myself (well you know money issues), utilizing all the technology's that I can. I also plan to have it open to the public for anyone to see it in action (teaching etc.).

P.S.
I'm not considering growing with lights at the moment (nothing wrong with it), just don't have the funds at the moment. I need $400 to $500 to replace a crashed computer before I can consider much else, and that's what's really on my mind as of late. Right now I have no plants growing. I am planing some lettuce and spinach in the same setup I grew lettuce before, after that things are up in the air. The daily highs are still in the 105 F to 107 F range but will go way down by mid October. Then I will need to deal with cool temps, that's why I didn't start the peppers I had planed.

I do have some ideas on growing under florescence's, but where to put them is the issue. No room inside the house, the garage may have some small space (If I clean it out) and outside there is no need (natural light). I'm very interested in seeing your new greenhouse up and running (thanks for all the earlier pic's).
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Last edited by GpsFrontier; 09-20-2010 at 06:32 AM.
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Old 09-20-2010, 01:16 PM
watercatwn6535nd watercatwn6535nd is offline
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I hope we get grwoing smarter faster. its hard to believ that some countries grow huge amounts of hydro food and other countries act as if it is something to be developed. I'm not usre if it was in a science barge video or not but i heard that if you went hydro on top of every skyscraper in new york it would be a big enough farm to feed the whole city local and fresh. Not sure if its true seems hard to belive to me but i do see benifits of roof top growing. think about in the cold weather you could be using thereexcess escaping heat from freezers dryers etc. 75F green house in december 1000ft up would be amazing.

Thats hot weather its been raining everyday here and 60 i would guess. i have been building my green house trusses on my days off in between showers. Was hoping to get out there today and do some welding but a front has parked up against the mountain here and its just pouring. my pond is running over, but my fish are happy?
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Old 10-25-2010, 10:59 PM
Hydromatic Hydromatic is offline
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Default Great thread

Newbie here. For the last year have been reading and finally started growing. Just one in my circle of friends is a grower and even less anyone doing hydro.

Glad to have found a forum talking about what I've been looking for.

I've got a few ideas and as things get along I'll be sharing.

For now, I just want to say thanks.

Bob

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