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-   -   drooping tomato plant (http://www.hydroponicsonline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1925)

simon 03-02-2011 02:28 PM

drooping tomato plant
 
The water temp is good at 65, ph at 6.0, Nutrients are ok i guess, water lev good. This happens as soon as the sun hits hit:(.It starts to come back to life at night and looks for the most part good. I can understand the plant getting heat stress if in the sun to long or temp to high, but in this case this happens as soon as the sun hits it. The tem out side has been between 75 and 80 last two weeks, so not to hot at all. This one really has me. I did include a picture of the plant and my other plants to show all is well with the rest but not this one. And let me add that the roots look nice and white and have lots of water/nutrients and two air stones. Maybe turger pressure?

Thank you Thank you for any Help
Simon
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/b...1/FILE0219.jpg
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/b...1/FILE0220.jpg
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/b...1/FILE0221.jpghttp://i207.photobucket.com/albums/b...1/FILE0224.jpg
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/b...1/FILE0223.jpg
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/b...1/FILE0220.jpg
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/b...1/FILE0221.jpg

GpsFrontier 03-02-2011 06:42 PM

Hello simon,
You have me stumped also. They sure seem to show signs of heat stress, especial when they dramatically wilt in the sun. But with an air temp of 75-80, water temp of 65, and the water level being good as well, it obviously isn't due to heat (even in full sun). My second thought would be a disease and/or fungus, however not if it's only happening when the sun hits it. Turgor pressure is something new to me. I do know that a loss of water pressure within the plant tissue will cause wilting, but never knew the specific term, nor do I know everything that will cause it (I have only dealt with heat issues so far). Reading from the link I posted it also suggests that wilting can being caused by salinity. Are you using tap water? Also it suggests wilting can be caused by ethylene (a plant hormone), but I'm not sure if that is related to the salinity of the water or not. I will try to look into causes of the loss of Turgor pressure.

P.S. I will send a e-mail to a tech at General Hydroponics with your situation, and see what he thinks. He usually gets back to me within 1 day during the week.

one800fish 03-02-2011 06:57 PM

Tomato Wilt
 
here's something on the subject. not sure if it covers your problem

https://utextension.tennessee.edu/pu...ts/sp370-c.pdf

simon 03-02-2011 07:52 PM

Thanks for the reply's and look forward to seeing what the tec may think. As far as the wilt? Hmmm I do not think so because at night it comes back to a fairly healthy looking plant. It is so weird because about 1 hour after the Sun hits hit it starts to go down for the count.I think i may try dropping the water temp even more just to see if that does anything.

Again Thank you !

GpsFrontier 03-03-2011 05:14 PM

Hello simon,
I just read the reply from the tech, I will send you a private message with the reply in full because I'm not sure it would be ethical to post a private e-mail publicly without their permission first. But it seems to be a lack of dissolved oxygen in the nutrient solution. In order to support the canopy, the root mass is gobbling up the oxygen faster than the air stones can dissolve it into the solution, and that a bigger reservoir with more circulation and aeration is the key.

simon 03-03-2011 05:22 PM

Okay, Hmmm it is six gallons but I could see by the mass that it could use a bigger setup. I am not sure what to do because I really do not want to give so much to just one plant. Maybe re-planting it in to coco coir. Hmm, i need to think about this. I will take a look at the message:) Thanks so much!

GpsFrontier 03-03-2011 06:59 PM

I don't know what resources you have to work with, but adding another or much larger air pump you can increase the amount of dissolved oxygen, and increase water circulation (especially with a large root mass). Another thing that can help is adding some hydrogen peroxide (H2O2), about 5mL per gallon (1 Tsp). Hydrogen peroxide is purified water and oxygen, so it can help raise the dissolved oxygen levels. But it also dissipates fairly quickly, I add that amount to all my systems weekly (sometimes a little more), and with roots that are using up the oxygen so fast, I'm not sure how much help that would be. But with a larger reservoir, the the larger volume of water will be able to hang onto the oxygen molecules longer. Simply because there will be more oxygen molecules for the plant to take, so they wont be depleted as fast.

Also if the entire root mass is submerged in the nutrient solution, you may try to lower the water level so that about one third of the root mass is above the water line. That should allow the root mass to get more air, and still not dry out. But it cant be stagnant air, so I would add some air holes at the top of the container, and with a larger air pump it should get some air circulation.

And I'm still not sure what water supply you are using for the nutrient solution, but tap, and water from a water softener may have a high salt content. So I would suggest using some type of filtered water instead.

P.S But in the long run, as you mentioned you might just want to transplant it into coco coir, and run it as a drip system. That would also be easy to add more tomato plants to the system, and still only need one reservoir, as well as one pump to grow them.

HPE21 03-18-2011 01:59 PM

This is a tricky thread. I was going to say it could be a genetic issue or a disease, but dissolved oxygen is a funny one. I've never heard of that problem, but I always wonder if it happens to people using small wal mart stones for huge reservoirs. I guess there is a point where you need more. Every time I come to these forums I learn interesting solutions.

ProZachJ 03-18-2011 02:03 PM

Why not bulk up on airstone and get a bigger air pump and see if that helps?

simon 03-20-2011 10:10 AM

I wanted to give this some time and try some things. I lowered the water level and added another stone and in about 3 days it started to come back strong. So the plant now grows bigger and it goes back to the old problem, so I put a 245 gal/p/m pump in and had the hose splashing the roots big time. It worked over night! All of this tells me that it was a lack of oxygen. And yes Wal-Mart stones just do not work and the small air pump to small and he water level was to high. Did I spend to much just for this one plant? NO! I learned a great deal. And I think I will as my son was telling me to start looking a bit more into areoponitics.

:rolleyes:Thank you so much for your help

Rkfm 03-20-2011 08:09 PM

I'm glad it worked out. Looks like it was on oxy problem. Good lesson for all of us.

GpsFrontier 03-20-2011 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simon (Post 6811)
I wanted to give this some time and try some things. I lowered the water level and added another stone and in about 3 days it started to come back strong. So the plant now grows bigger and it goes back to the old problem, so I put a 245 gal/p/m pump in and had the hose splashing the roots big time. It worked over night! All of this tells me that it was a lack of oxygen. And yes Wal-Mart stones just do not work and the small air pump to small and he water level was to high. Did I spend to much just for this one plant? NO! I learned a great deal. And I think I will as my son was telling me to start looking a bit more into areoponitics.

:rolleyes:Thank you so much for your help

Thanks for the update, I was wondering how they were doing just the other day. I'm wondering what air stones your using now that work better? I haven't used anything but the ones from wal-mart. Though I do know the round tube like ones just clog. So I started using the blue stones.

simon 03-21-2011 02:13 PM

None of the stones work to good for me at this point with out changing them out every two weeks and giving them a CLR bath with a good rinse. I have taken the stones off in my one set up and just put the tubes right in to the water. I do not suggest that but it has worked for now. I am looking into tube bubbler's and working on making my own. I have really learned BIG time that Oxygenation is very very important and looking how to over come the problem in the future. Like I said, I am looking more into Aeroponics at this point and to try that.:rolleyes:

FYI: things are growing great in coco coir right now, wow I love it.
http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/b...1/FILE0230.jpg

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/b...1/FILE0229.jpg

ProZachJ 03-21-2011 11:14 PM

Yea...coir really is a great medium.

haroldkate 09-12-2011 11:08 PM

Well every time I come to these forums I learn interesting solutions, this is great!!!!!


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