Stuck in China with no hydroponic nutrient

[kakaze]

I used to live in China as well, and the difficulty in finding certain items that I took for granted in the states was very annoying!

As far as hydroponic nutrients go, maybe I can help.

Plants need 6 macronutrients. These are Nitrogen (N), Phosphorus (P), Potassium (K), Calcium (Ca), Magnesium (Mg) and Sulfur (S). The "NPK" that you see on the fertilizer bags stands for "Nitrogen - Phosphorus - Potassium". Even if it were water-solubal, you'd probably still need to add calcium, magnesium, and sulpher.

In addition to the above, plants also need a small amount of Iron (Fe), Boron (B), Manganese (Mn), Zinc (Zn), Copper (Cu), Molybdenum (Mo) and Chlorine (Cl).

The simplest home-made hydroponic nutrient solution that I've heard of is a compost tea made out of composted chicken manure. I don't know about the availability of composted chicken manure in China & Hong Kong, but I do know that chickens are popular there, so it's possible. If you make a chicken compost tea, you might want to add nitrogen and phosphorus. Some plants, such as tomatoes and strawberries, need a lot of nitrogen, and phosphorus is important for any flowering/fruiting plant.

On a side note; most soil fertilizers use Urea and Sulfate of Ammonia as sources of nitrogen. These do not work well in hydroponics because they need bacteria to break them down before plants can absorb them. Instead, you should use Ammonium Sulfate or Sodium Nitrate.

The recipes that I've found for home-made solutions are:

Potassium Nitrate 9 oz (255 grams) - Also called Saltpeter
Calcium Sulphate 7 oz (198 grams) - Plaster of Paris
Magnesium Sulphate 6 oz (170 grams) - Epsom Salts
Monocalcium Phosphate 4 oz (113 grams)
Ammonium Sulfate 1.5 oz (43 grams) - Principle source of Nitrogen in recipe
Iron Sulphate - Use a pinch only; maybe 1/2 t

Grind each chemical up and mix together well. Use 1 teaspoon per gallon of water.

Another recipe is:

Sodium Nitrate 12.5 oz (355 grams) - Nitrogen
Potassium Sulphate 4 oz (113 grams) - Potassium, Sulphur
Super Phosphate 5 oz (142 grams) - Phosphate, Calcium
Magnesium Sulphate 3.5 oz (100 grams) - Magnesium, Sulphur
Iron Sulphate – 1 pinch (2 grams) - Iron

Once again, use 1 teaspoon per gallon of water.

Here is another recipe solely for trace elements:

Manganese Sulphate 1 t
Boric Acid powder 1 t
Zinc Sulphate 0.5 t
Copper Sulphate 0.5 t

These can all be found in mineral vitamins at a health store.

When needed add 0.5 tsp to 1 quart water and mix well. Add 1 liquid oz of this solution to 3 gallons of your plant nutrients solution from above. This solution will not keep past one day, so use the remainder to water any "in-soil" plants you may have around.

I have not tried any of these recipes yet, so I have no idea how well they work. If you do try one, please let me know!

Hope that helps!

[tufekoa]

Hi luche, Hi kakaze,

Thanks for your previous answers they have put me on the right track and gave a bit of hope.
I am growing tomatoes with children in china.
We are using NPK soil nutrients with an obscure micronutrient solution.(no details on the quantity of iron zinc borum)
20-20-20 vegetive and 10-30-20 flower.
The results are variable but mostly tremendous veg groth with little production and premature plant casualties.(yellow from the tip of the the leaves and generally a drying up of plants)
It like if the plants can not retain the water properly in the flower stage.
More over the flowering stage takes ages and the plant just grow bigger.

Any way I was wondering if kakaze your solution would work for tomatoes?
Luche globalization is strange for sure: many articles made here are never sold here. I'm interested in a formula that i could submit to the city chemist.

Bests,

Tuff

Ps : I have purchased some general hydroponics during a trip that I am trying out on a small batch.
They seem okay but it's ridiculously expensive for our larger setting.

[kakaze]

Like I said, I've not tried either of the recipes yet. In fact, I'm just getting into hydroponics myself, so anything anyone here says that contradicts me is probably more correct.

According to this site:

Reasons Why Tomato Plants Leaves Turn Yellow

tomato plants yellow due to a lack of nitrogen, sunshine, or water. Pests & fungus can also cause yellowing. Too much nitrogen usually gives abundant foliage growth, but poor fruiting. Check to make sure they're getting enough water and try giving them a bit less nitrogen and a bit more phosphorus (if you can't find Phosphorus, grind up some eggshells and bake them until they just start turning brown. eggshells contain about 1% nitrogen, about 0.5% phosphoric acid.

If they're not getting enough sun, you may want to supliment them with a flourescent light (if you can't find one for plants, get one that says "cool white"; it's got more blue in it, which is what plants need to grow). You could also try an led growlight. Here's a company in Hong Kong that sells them for a good price (no, I'm not affiliated):

Besthongkong - Eastern LED Source Shop: Loose LED, High Power LED, Car Auto LED, LED Light bulbs, LED Strips, LED Flashlight, LED Module LED Growing lights

If you do try the chicken manure compost tea, you may have trouble with clogging in an aerophonic system. If it were me, I'd grow the plants in aquarium gravel (you should be able to find one of those "wet markets" that sells pets & pet supplies pretty easily) with a drip-feed system.

Something else to keep in mind; are your tomatoes all female, or all male? If they're mixed, do they get any kind of breeze blowing past them to spread pollen? No pollen = no fruit.

[shadoh6]

As an update to my ancient post on not being able to find nutrients in China, after much time and effort, I have secured a source for a proven, international brand hydroponic nutrient, other hydroponic additives (silica, PK boosters, etc.) and even specialized equipment (HID lighting, PPM meters, etc.), so if anybody is interested in buying this in China, then PM me.

[pengyou]

I also live in China, in Shenzhen. Taobao has almost everything - maybe everything you need to do hp gardening.

[shadoh6]

Taobao has almost everything, and things have gotten a lot better since 2009 when I first created this post! However, the quality and reliability of the sellers and equipment is still a bit of a lucky draw. Having lived here for so long, I have some good sources or can custom make things myself, so if anybody is interested or needs some help building hydroponics systems in China, then PM me.

@pengyou: It's good to see another hydroponics enthusiast on the mainland! If you are ever in Shanghai, let me know and I can show you the hydroponics systems I am running. I am currently doing about 2.4 sqm of completely enclosed and isolated systems, testing the growing results between a 220w X2-style LED grow light against a 600w HID air cooled reflector, using a top drip automated irrigation system and Canadian imported nutrient solution by Advanced Nutrients.

[Yello]

Shadoh6 & 朋友

Interesting topic! I'm in Hong Kong and to me it looks like things are way easier to get in China then here. Taobao has plenty of hits when you search for 'shui pei'. But it is rather confusing when it comes to fertilizer.

Are there any particular Taobao fertilizer products you can recommend? I'm just starting and I need the whole range I guess. I plan to do some eatable stuff and want to start with something really easy such as mint, basil (Thai basil I can get by the pound), parsley etc. All from cloned wet market plants. Later tomatoes.

As system I like to use a fogger, because of the zero noise. All DIY.

One OT question, sorry, you guys have any problems with the heat? I wonder a bit if my plants can handle the humid summer here.

Update: Standard fertilizer ingredients seem easy to get on Taobao. I did some translation:

1.00 gallon(s) FRUITING NUTRIENT NPK: 8.2-5.9-13.6
Calcium Nitrate Ca(NO3)2 8.00 硝酸钙
Potassium Nitrate KNO3 2.80 硝酸钾
Sulfate of Potash K2SO4 1.70 硫酸钾
Monopotassium Phosphate KH2PO4 1.39 磷酸二氢钾
Magnesium Sulfate MgSO4 * 7H2O 2.40 硫酸镁

Another update:
When you do a Taobao search for EDTA or DTPA or EDDHA you will find enough sources for chelated iron.

And another update:
I find it a bit troublesome to mix the fertilizer every time I need it. Having concentrates would be MUCH easier. This link is a gold mine:

http://preparedforthat.com/a-homemad...lution-recipe/

Here are the addedd trace stuff and its Chinese name for your Taobao search:

Zinc Sulphate ZnSO4 硫酸锌
Manganese Sulphate MnSO4 硫酸锰
Copper Sulphate CuSO4 硫酸铜
Boric Acid H3BO3 硼酸
Sodium Molybdate Na2MoO4 钼酸钠

All is available in the RMB 10 range. So far I couldn't find one supplier that has all.


PS: LOL > Yummy Coriander